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| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Griffin |
Posted - 15 Apr 2012 : 22:55:41
Flight leads who took part in this Sunday's mission, "Good Bait Catches Fine Fish" are requested to post a debrief of their flights actions, including any lessons learned or that should be learned by others.
Please put the following information at the top of your post:
Flight Role: (SEAD, ESCORT, STRIKE, Etc..)
Callsign11: "Pilot's name" AA=X AG=X RTB,MIA/KIA,EJT
Callsign12: "Pilot's name" AA=X AG=X RTB,MIA/KIA,EJT
Callsign13: "Pilot's name" AA=X AG=X RTB,MIA/KIA,EJT
Callsign14: "Pilot's name" AA=X AG=X RTB,MIA/KIA,EJT
Mission Outcome: MS,PS,MF
Posts by this Tuesday please
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| 11 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Joif |
Posted - 18 Apr 2012 : 19:44:08
Following up on my lessons to learn comments in the debrief, I have being doing some practice with EOM harm mode and it seems the missiles impact a maximum of 30 seconds after the stated time impact time on the MFD, so in future if the SAM site is still active after 45 seconds after the stated time then we know the harm has missed and is safe for a follow up launch.
I got a consistent 100% hit ratio on the training TE but we all know Sunday TE's don't like to abide normal solo rules. Just thought it would be good to feedback with my findings.
Took some screenshots whilst playing around too..
Somehow I didn't feel very welcome here :(, insert your own captions..
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| Crowebar |
Posted - 16 Apr 2012 : 21:21:53
Sorry, scores wrong - evil of copy & paste!
Here is correct
Panther 1 - Escort
Panther 11: "Crowebar" AA=2 AG=0 RTB
Panther 12: "oly" AA=2 AG=0 RTB
Panther 13: "Blade" AA=1 AG=0 RTB
Panther 14: "Navman" AA=0 AG=0 EJT (green flying with Blue)
Dmans1: ELOA
Mission Outcome: MS
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| Crowebar |
Posted - 16 Apr 2012 : 21:19:55
Panther 1 - Escort
Panther 11: "Crowebar" AA=2 AG=0 RTB
Panther 12: "oly" AA=1 AG=0 RTB
Panther 13: "Blade" AA=4 AG=0 RTB
Panther 14: "Navman" AA=4 AG=0 EJT (green flying with Blue)
Dmans1: ELOA
Mission Outcome: MS
sorry - No Debrief txt created for me or anyone in Panther.
First contacts were group of 4 Mig-29A approaching from the West. These were successfully engaged without loss or incident. Closer to target we engaged a 2nd group of bandits, 2 X SU-27, once again destroyed with no loss.
We loitered along with Falcon at the edge of SA-6 engagement zone while strike flight hit target. At this point we were engaged by AAA battalion, who managed to hit and damage Navman.
Navman stayed with the flight for the return flight home. He was instructed to remain at the rear of Panther flight for security, as we knew there were multiple contacts on route.
As the situation developed with 3 sets of contacts ahead I made 2 radio calls as flight lead.
1. I instructed Navman to fall back behind us and to stay away from the fight.
2. I broadcast on UHF that we were a 3 ship for coming engagement as panther 1-4 was damaged. Granted, I didn't give the specific location of Navman as we were all busy on comms at that time with 3 groups inbound on us.
Panther flight engaged the Western group ok with no loss, and helped with the last group. We lost Navman through friendly fire most probably because he was not where he had been instructed to be, he didn't call budy spike, but shouldn't have been there in the first place. Sorry Navman, but constructive criticism and a lesson learnt I hope.
I personally felt I had done a reasonable job as flight lead, certainly to the best of my ability, given I'm not a trained fighter pilot. If it wasn't up to the standard of others, well thats life really.
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| Elmo |
Posted - 16 Apr 2012 : 19:14:49
Flight Role: (STRIKE)
Cowboy11: "Elmo" AA=0 AG=0 EJT
Cowboy12: "Novac" AA=0 AG=2 RTB
Mission Outcome: MS
Strike mission to destroy Manp'o Airbase before 05:38.
Took off and climbed to angles 25, had to keep speed above 300 knots to ensure we arrived on time and ended up overtaking our escort flight. First SA4 was destroyed which allowed us to skirt to the East of the second while that was being dealt with.
While the SEAD and Escort flights dealt with the air threats we slowed down and beamed the targets to allow the engagements to take place.
Once the air threats were dealt with we then pushed at buster towards target and prior to entering the SA2 threat circle dropped down into the weeds. Had no problem on the way into target until the last moment when Novac turned to our push point and I realised that my steerpoints had not updated in my hsd although Novacs had????? so in my rush to try and turn back and realign for the runway got a bit high, next thing I knew had an SA6 launch warning and then was in the shoot. Novac managed his bomb run successfully destroying the runway and from what I can tell flew out under the SA6 and AAA without event before climbing up to support the escort flights for the way home. Bit of a blue on blue incident unfortunately but then RTB'd.
Sorry but no debrief file for me to show what happened.
Elmo |
| mango |
Posted - 16 Apr 2012 : 18:08:16
Just a small addition to Joifs debrief and on a more sombre note, got a peek at the condolence letter 185th command wrote to the deers wife,it went something like: Dear Mrs deer very sorry for the loss of your husband John-Deere (which by strange coincidence is my tractors name too) in a tragic A2G accident... and soforth.
Sorry guys I know this is off track but its been going through my head all day.  |
| wolfman |
Posted - 16 Apr 2012 : 16:53:22
Thanks Joif for a perfect description. I agree 100%. Not need to add anything. :) |
| Griffin |
Posted - 16 Apr 2012 : 13:25:27
Results are up. Please check and report any issues. Ta.
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| Griffin |
Posted - 16 Apr 2012 : 13:18:29
Falcon 1 - Escort
Falcon 11: "Griffin" AA=4 AG=0 RTB
Falcon 12: "Floyd" AA=1 AG=0 EJT
Mission Outcome: PS
We changed teh role of our flight to suit the numbers we had, so we dropped our SEAD role for an escort one.
Combining with Panther 1, we climbed to high angels and moved to close escort of Cowboy while Panther went to cover the flanks.
We had two incoming groups of bandits arrive around teh same time as we crossed the flot and we engaged the ones on the nose (with Lobo who were infront of us on SEAD duty) while Panther looked to the western threats.
Once they were dispatched we skirted around an SA-6 after Lobo had got rid of the first SA-4 threat.
We continued north and Cowboy went in for the strike while we capped around our SP3. After the attack we regrouped and headed towards home.
This is where it got messy.
Our flight was in front and we were advised of three sets of contacts, some active shooters. Panther and we sorted on the various threats and proceeded to take them down. What we DIDN'T know was that Navman had been damaged and was flying home, unfortunately straight towards the western threats. AWACS told us where the threats were and that position roughly coincided where Navman was.
Can you guess what happened next?...
I fired at Navman, but he evaded my shot, but he didn't avoid Floyds and down he went. Shortly afterwards I had a missile fired at me from behind (had to be a blue missile) and so did Floyd. I evaded mine but Floyd din't and down he went.
The rest of the mission was uneventful and I landed safely at Home Plate.
Lessons learned:
1. If you are damaged then your flight lead should tell the others of your intentions, but regardless you should try to keep with the group and take defensive action if the rest get into a fight.
2. Be sure of your target. AWACs is there to be used. In this case Lumper would not have seen Navman but the AI AWACs would.
3. If all else fails use Raygun. Even if you don't get an answer from the contact, you may from it's flight lead.
A really good and enjoyable mission from Floyd that highlighted some areas in which we need to sharpen up.
RECORD BEGIN TIMESTAMP 4/15/2012 22:15:58.
Game is Tactical Engagement type Networked
Mission name: Good bait catches fine fish
Mission Type: SEAD Escort
Flight Unique Id: Falcon1
2 Ship Flight
Ac type: F-16C-52
Contry: U.S.
FLIGHT EVENTS
Event Griffin joined as Falcon11 at 04:56:03
Event Floyd joined as Falcon12 at 04:56:05
Event AA-10C launched at Griffin 05:19:39
Event AA-10C launched at Floyd 05:19:52
Event DPRK SU-27 downed by Griffin at 05:20:24
Event DPRK MiG-29A downed by Griffin at 05:31:33
Event SA2 launched at Griffin 05:33:16
Event SA2 launched at Griffin 05:33:24
Event DPRK SU-27 downed by Griffin at 05:54:16
Event DPRK SU-27 downed by Griffin at 05:56:31
Event Navman downed by Floyd at 05:56:35
Event F-16C-52 Novac launched AIM-120B at Floyd 05:56:40
Event DPRK SU-27 downed by Floyd at 05:56:59
Event Floyd ejected at 05:57:03
Event Floyd exited from Falcon12 at 05:58:18
Event Griffin landed at 06:15:31
Event Griffin exited from Falcon11 at 06:21:23
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PILOT SLOT 1:
Human Player: Maj. Griffin
Callsign: Griffin
Pilot status - OK
Aircraft status - OK
AA Kills 4
AG Kills 0
AS Kills 0
AN Kills 0
Shoot At 3
Other Player Kills 0
WEAPON DATA
LOADOUT 0: 20mm M61
Starting Load 510
Fired 0
Missed 0
Hit 0
LOADOUT 1: AIM-120B
Starting Load 6
Fired 6
Missed 2
Hit 4
Event AIM-120B released at 05:19:24@72hit SU-27 - destroyed
Event AIM-120B released at 05:30:52@72hit MiG-29A - destroyed
Event AIM-120B released at 05:52:56@72hit SU-27 - destroyed
Event AIM-120B released at 05:54:14@72miss
Event AIM-120B released at 05:54:42@72miss
Event AIM-120B released at 05:55:31@72hit SU-27 - destroyed
LOADOUT 2: 370 Gal Tank
Starting Load 2
Fired 0
Missed 0
Hit 0
LOADOUT 3: ALQ-131
Starting Load 1
Fired 0
Missed 0
Hit 0
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PILOT SLOT 2:
Human Player: Capt. Floyd
Callsign: Floyd
Pilot status - MIA
Aircraft status - DESTROYED
AA Kills 1
AG Kills 0
AS Kills 0
AN Kills 0
Shoot At 2
Other Player Kills 1
WEAPON DATA
LOADOUT 0: 20mm M61
Starting Load 510
Fired 0
Missed 0
Hit 0
LOADOUT 1: AIM-120B
Starting Load 6
Fired 6
Missed 3
Hit 3
Event AIM-120B released at 05:17:30@72miss
Event AIM-120B released at 05:19:37@72miss
Event AIM-120B released at 05:31:20@72miss
Event AIM-120B released at 05:53:36@72hit SU-27 - damaged
Event AIM-120B released at 05:55:53@72hit F-16C-40 - destroyed
Event AIM-120B released at 05:56:31@72hit SU-27 - destroyed
LOADOUT 2: 370 Gal Tank
Starting Load 2
Fired 0
Missed 0
Hit 0
LOADOUT 3: ALQ-131
Starting Load 1
Fired 0
Missed 0
Hit 0
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| Griffin |
Posted - 16 Apr 2012 : 07:34:39
Mango, would you email that to me please?
I have taken a note of all the results from last night and will post them here.
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| mango |
Posted - 16 Apr 2012 : 05:06:52
Sorry mate cant help, I have Griffins flights debrief only? |
| Joif |
Posted - 16 Apr 2012 : 00:04:25
Flight Role: SEAD
Lobo11: "Joif" AA=2 AG=1 RTB
Lobo12: "Wolfman" AA=0 AG=1 RTB
Lobo13: "Mango" AA=0 AG=2 RTB
Lobo14: "Sabre" AA=X AG=X Lost early due to tech.
Mission Outcome: PS
Just a short debrief from me as usual... 
Took off a few minutes early to give the strike flight as much of a time window as possible, climbed to A25. Upon nearing the first SA-4 Sabre found out for whatever reason he was unable to slew the sensor cursors so had to back out which put us at a slight disadvantage early on. We proceeded on to the first SA-4 which Wolfman engaged with a salvo of 2 AGM-88's, given the time constraints we didn't want to wait 3 minutes extra to find out if it 1 missile would have missed.
We then proceeded on steer point until nearing the second SA-4 site, for which I was in range and the escort flight were also in-line with us putting them also at danger so decided it would be best for me to engage, first initial missile looks to have missed, a follow up missile was needed which destroyed the radar a few seconds after launches on Griffin.
Upon approaching the target area I had a small BVR skirmish with a single remaining MiG-29A, trading a AIM-120 for a AA-10C the target disappeared shortly after debrief confirmed my 120 had hit.
By this point the strike flight had caught up and had overtaken 3 which was carrying our remaining harms, the SA-2 on target was destroyed in time, but unfortunately the harm on the SA-6 splashed around 10-20 seconds after one of the strike flight had been hit.
Returning home we had a few friendly F-16's in front of us so we monitored the Mig and SU group as broadcast comms made it clear they were being engaged and to save firing any missiles for the target to be splashed by the other flight before a slammer went active and then stuff would get messy.
Whilst monitoring one of the MiG29A's got within 15nm so I engaged in self defense as the MiG was still in hot and didn't look to be going defensive.
Lobo flight then RTB with no damage.. and I also hear that Wolfman's had to evade a wild deer which ran across the runway the stresses of which caused fatal gear failure and he should be applauded for his quick reactions and giving his life to save an innocent deer.
Generally it was a good turnout from Green... we had 5 after Navman showed up so top effort guys, and I am happy with all your performances and it was a good confidence boost after our last SEAD mission which didn't go in our favour.
Perhaps the only thing we need to work on is not getting split up as easily (easier said than done, I know.. especially with fuel consumption), not only does it give Lumper an easier time directing us efficiently but there would have been less delay of the final harm strike.
The mission was a good one, gave us alot to think about from the brief to all the way home again, thanks Floyd.
and I personal lesson is to probably kick this over dependency on using HARMS with the HAD so you are guessing if the missile has hit or missed, I'm going to train myself to trust PB-EOM employment modes so we can atleast give estimated impact times and would give us a much easier time figuring out if I missile is still in flight or missed altogether allowing better missile management and less wasted harms.
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| 185th VFS |
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